Welcome to Legal Tech Matters, a Litera podcast dedicated to creating conversations about trends, technology and innovation for modern law firms and companies. Big and small.
00;00;16;02 - 00;00;28;16
Caroline Hill
Hi everyone, and welcome to the latest LEGALTECH MATTERS podcast. I'm Caroline Hill, editor in chief of Legal IT Insider. And I'm joined by Joy Health Rush, who needs no introduction, CEO of ILTA. Hi, Joy.
00;00;28;25 - 00;00;31;23
Joy Heath Rush
Hey, Caroline. So great to be with you.
00;00;32;08 - 00;00;39;03
Caroline Hill
I'm great to be with you, too. And it's a busy time of year when you must be on big countdown now for ILTACON.
00;00;39;03 - 00;00;54;19
Joy Heath Rush
This is, you know, the old saying about I wish I had more than 24 hours in the day. There has to be some kind of metric conversion or something that can give me more hours in the day. I haven't figured it out yet, like kilos to pounds. It's got to be something I want to do to give me some more hours. So, let's work on that.
00;00;55;29 - 00;01;18;28
Caroline Hill
And so, I really can't keep a short period of time away from, away from your busy schedule. But I thought it would be a really great opportunity to talk to you about the run up to LTA, about where you are in terms of preparations and what people need to be thinking about and to the content and logistics, I think we can all also acknowledge it's been for any event it's been a bumpy few years, and you and I spoke this time last year about the preparation and it was a very different conversation. We talked about hand sanitiser and special dispensation and whether people were going to go to the event. How is it at the moment? How is the planning going in that sense?
00;01;40;00 - 00;02;07;09
Joy Heath Rush
You know, it's, it's not 2019. Let me start with that where we set a record. You know, we had more people than ever, but we're actually over a thousand for full week member registrations and then we have non-member, we have consulting. I like to measure just that full week member attendees. So, we're way ahead of just about every year in our history except 2019.
So, I'm very happy about that. But yes, there are some changes we made last year Caroline for health and safety that we're going to keep. I mean, I dare say we will never go back to serving food exactly the way that we did before. You know, the hotel industry, the hospitality industry has fundamentally changed. Keyless entry to your hotel room, touchless registration at the hotel, all of these kinds of things that the hospitality industry developed during the pandemic are just here.
That's going to be the norm going forward. We expect some people to be masked, some people not. It's a choice because there's no, in the D.C. area, there's no jurisdictional mandate for masks. But we want people to be comfortable. We do have a vaccination, mandatory vaccination policy. Most people, I think, have been very happy about that. Some have been distressed about it.
And I've had a lot of conversations with them. But my feeling is, you know, the science says that people that get COVID don't get sick if they've been vaccinated. If somebody gets sick on my watch, I don't want them to get seriously sick. And to me, that's what the vaccination policy is about. And making people feel comfortable. And there will be plenty of social events.
I think I keep hearing I'm waiting for one of those "Joy" hugs. I've heard that a whole bunch is, you know, that's one of my specialities.
00;03;37;11 - 00;03;39;12
Caroline Hill
And I'm looking forward to that too.
00;03;41;07 - 00;04;02;20
Joy Heath Rush
So, there's a lot of interest in people. They just want to reconnect. They want to be together again. So, the level of enthusiasm about gathering is so fantastic. And then you layer the education on top of it. You know, it's hard not to get excited this time next month, I will be onsite already.
00;04;03;04 - 00;04;24;14
Caroline Hill
I'm like, goodness, I'm it's hard to know, isn't it? So do you feel it seems to be certainly that Covid in the UK is on the increase, but it's less terrible. Do you feel like people are people waiting to see what happens or do you think people are just saying, you know what, I'm done with this and I'm just going to book for people, for people that are kind of wondering whether to book the ticket or whatever? What's the mood you are sensing?
00;04;27;01 - 00;04;53;09
Joy Heath Rush
Certainly, in the U.S. as a society, the mood is very much we're tired of this and we can find a way to gather safely. I mean, sporting events, theatre events. Just yesterday here in Chicago for Broadway in New York, which had been had masking requirements. Yeah. Either Broadway or Chicago. Anyway, the theatres had had masking requirements have now been eliminated.
So, people, I think, are also taking a lot of personal responsibility for doing what they feel comfortable with, what they feel is healthy for them and for their families. And so, it's really just kind of people seem to have the sense of, this is here to stay to some degree. And we have to learn how to function in a world with the common cold and the flu and COVID.
00;05;19;15 - 00;05;35;15
Caroline Hill
Yeah. And it's just, you know, I've been doing more getting out. I've realised that I've got quite lazy and it's something that I'm going to have to start to battle with when I go into town, when I get to London, but there's no substitute for seeing people face to face, you know, and this and I and I'm really excited.
I'm coming to ILTACON and there is just no substitute for that face to face networking and exchange of information. Right? It's something you can't do on Zoom to the same effect.
00;05;46;29 - 00;06;15;12
Joy Heath Rush
Well, what is it that Simon Sinek says people buy from people, you know, so for the commercial relationship, it's just true. And, and the supplier community has done a wonderful job adapting to a couple of years where they had to do mostly virtual and they've learnt they've got new tools in their toolbox but at the end of the day, law in particular and everything around law is a relationship business.
It just is. And so, people want, you can have great relationships across the miles and video conferencing helps a ton, but the in-person experience just can't be replaced really.
00;06;27;27 - 00;06;43;28
Caroline Hill
Thank you mentioned virtual, which is interesting. So, so last year we were talking about you for the first time creating a sort of almost hybrid event or trying to start creating as much virtual content as possible. Is that how did that work out and are you going to do the same again?
00;06;44;13 - 00;07;11;01
Joy Heath Rush
You know, I would say that it worked out beautifully from the attendee perspective. I think what we didn't fully appreciate is it's really running three conferences, Caroline, and not two you run the fully in-person conference, which takes X amount of staffing. You run a virtual conference, which takes Y amount of staffing. And then you have the pieces where they cross over, which is X amount of staffing.
It's very complicated. And what makes it more complicated is and I'm sure you've run into this in the UK, internet connectivity and hotels is not always the very best and when you're trying then to connect a thousand people, you now live streaming an event and it gets challenging. And so, we decided we were going to go back fully in-person this year and then evaluate what we can do going forward.
Because the piece that I hate to lose by not having the virtual component is it just made the event accessible to people who would not otherwise be able to attend. You know, we had people from Tokyo, we had people from South Africa, we had, you know, the Australians couldn't travel last year You know, we, we had folks from Australia.
We tend to have folks that are in roles that might not qualify them to travel, but that can't participate in the educational content. I don't want to lose that. But on the other hand, we have to be able to do it with quality. We have to be. I don't want to lose that, but we have to be able to do it with quality training.
00;08;30;09 - 00;08;36;23
Caroline Hill
So, you're taking a pause in that virtual completely. So, there's going to be no virtual challenge whereby you sort of take stock.
00;08;37;02 - 00;08;58;01
Joy Heath Rush
Exactly right. And in the meantime, we're offering a nice suite of other virtual events like today and tomorrow. We're doing an encore presentation of our Mastering Microsoft Teams two-day virtual event that sold out. I had a waiting list the last time, so we sold it out again, and we've now been asked to do it at a UK friendly time zone.
So, I think we're going to the work on that. But we need to make sure that we have the right balance of virtual and in-person education. And I think we're going to be taking a very hard look at what that will look like for ILTACON next year.
00;09;11;25 - 00;09;31;22
Caroline Hill
I did slightly worry that with the virtual element that particularly with budgets and, you know, people being, and I do think there's a laziness so that, you know, we will almost become a bit reclusive. And that's the corporate mentality that probably goes to the corporate mentality as well. I did worry slightly that with the virtual element, would it be almost an excuse to not send people?
That was my concern. You know, I don't know whether that is something that you'll be looking at. I take your point completely about it makes it accessible for the geographies and be for the people with. So is a lot to think about, isn't it?
00;09;44;02 - 00;10;10;27
Joy Heath Rush
And I think that this is a debate that's happening broadly in the events industry. So, like in my own professional development, you know, I'm obviously a legal tech geek and have been for 40 years, but I'm also an association executive. And so, I have my professional development, I do as an association executive and a lot of the content we've had in the past year on that side of my job has been about changes and event policies and how events are going to be created.
Because for nearly all associations, events are a major source of service delivery to your members and a major source of revenue, both of those things. So, this is a debate that's not going away. And I mean, we're talking about the same debate with events that draw 30 and 40 and 50,000 people, not just ones that are two, three or four thousand people like our events.
00;10;34;15 - 00;10;49;20
Caroline Hill
Yeah, yeah. Okay. Well, we'll catch up on that later next year. I think say in terms of content. So, you've got a great keynote. I'm going to, I'm going to kill his surname – aren't I, so Patrick Schwerdtfeger...
00;10;50;27 - 00;10;51;28
Joy Heath Rush
You're doing fine.
00;10;52;20 - 00;11;07;03
Caroline Hill
So, he's been confirmed as a keynote. So, he's business futurist. He specializes in big data, AI FinTech, blockchain. He's got fairly disgusting amount of books and speak slots to his name. And I'm one of these people that just makes you feel inadequate.
00;11;07;29 - 00;11;09;06
Joy Heath Rush
Underachieving. Right.
00;11;10;23 - 00;11;23;05
Caroline Hill
But why aside, why did you choose him? So, it's interesting that he's talking about big data and AI. So, what was the thinking behind him on both days, isn't he?
00;11;23;10 - 00;11;41;12
Joy Heath Rush
Yeah, that's a great it's a great question. And one of the things and you've attended, this will be my 26th ILTACON and you've attended a few so you know that we try to design the keynote so that it becomes almost a subtheme throughout the week. You will see people will talk about the keynote all week. The sessions will draw it together.
So first of all, we look for somebody who's engaging because you want to start that week with energy, with someone who's going to engage the audience. And he's very engaging. But in terms of his skills and his CV, it's that sense of we're all in the business of marrying law and relationships and technology and trying to figure out where all those pieces exist, what is all stuff and what is technology stuff and where do they cross over and what is big data and what does that mean for us? We felt like his experience kind of drew those threads together in a way that would set kind of you know, set the tone and the theme for the whole week.
I think that people are really going to like him. And then, of course, we do other day keynotes which you know, and I always look forward. Well, the Thursday keynote is a recap of our G100 and G200 events where we have members of the advisory groups for both of those going over what they talked about in their sessions.
So, what's top of mind for them? And that is always intensely interesting to all of our attendees. They want to know whether they're a big firm, small firm, they want to know what the big firms are worried about and what they're doing. And I'm really looking forward to that.
00;13;00;27 - 00;13;20;05
Caroline Hill
I'm looking forward to that as well because there's a sense you see those are sort of closed sessions and very much know people. I think that people will be really keen to attend those and it's really useful. What are the key themes going through the events of the you've talked about data and AI and all of those things that Patrick will be talking about?
Do they seem to set the tone? Is that possible? So, what are the key themes that you're going to be developing into...
00;13;27;03 - 00;13;50;29
Joy Heath Rush
That's a great question. So I would say in looking at the programme myself, so this is kind of my, my, my takeaway of that is there's a lot about how technology is practical and not theoretical, like how many sessions over the years and this is fine, I'm not criticising it, but have been about blockchain as a kind of a theoretical, an idea.
Well, this year's session is about blockchain in practice. I mean, the real estate industry has moved to blockchain a pretty significant way in terms of trying to create immutable records of real estate transactions. So, what does that mean for us? Because technologists have to be ready for a lawyer to come and say, what's this blockchain thing I'm hearing about?
And, you know, what do you need to know about it? I think the second theme is this sense of what will stick following the work from home. That is the hybrid workforce, more adoption of cloud technologies. Caroline, I know you've seen that in the industry. The acceleration of adoption of cloud that we would have been talking about that three years ago is, you know, is surprising or would have been surprising.
And it really changed things about it. Operations at every train or conversation I've had, for example, has been how do we keep up with the pace, you know, cloud applications. I can't control the pace at which new features are introduced. How do I keep up? I already have trouble getting my people to come to training. How is it changing their operations?
All the people that are doing Active Directory now with the cloud and hybrid systems you know what does this mean for talent? It's been a huge issue in the industry, as you know. And so, it's that sense of is the pendulum going to swing or are we going to be more back in the office? Are we living with this?
And what does living with it mean for our conference rooms and our choice of technology? And how we operate IT? That's a really important subtheme. So, there's a lot of taking cutting edge technology and making it practical, like this is real. How do I do it? What do I have to think about? And then there's a sense of where do we work, how do we work, and how long will we be dealing with that?I think to me those are two kinds of central themes.
00;15;57;21 - 00;16;17;05
Caroline Hill
I think, gosh, I think you've hit the nail on the head. I think that that's what everybody is talking about. So, you know, I'm really looking forward to is it too late for just from a practical perspective for people listening to this? Hopefully, it will be published instantly. So do you. Is it too late if you got all the speakers sort of general that kind of thing?
00;16;17;28 - 00;16;47;12
Joy Heath Rush
And I will tell you, we had a record number of speaker applications this year. We had over five hundred applications for seventy slots. We have one or two where we are where we have a speaker needs. So, if someone is interested, they can reach out to me as no promises, but we do have one or two. But we had, as I said, over five hundred so that the interest was tremendous.
So, we have seventy general educational sessions, we have a bunch of speciality sessions like the women who lead, and the diversity workshop and you know, those kinds of the tech survey overview, those are kind of like all speciality sessions we're doing. Of course, the G100 and the G200. We have our Start-Up Hub, and we have Start-Ups doing pitches on Thursday.
So, people who want to see the latest Start-Ups can sit and listen to the pitches for the Start-Up companies. So, there is a lot of extra stuff built in beyond that core seventy. So, I am thrilled but it's not, it's not necessarily too late and if you're really interested, as I said, ping me because see what we can do.
00;17;34;17 - 00;17;52;13
Caroline Hill
With let us talk about the Start-Ups as you mentioned them. So, what was I like the sort of hub? Yes, it's a great though obviously it's really well supported what was the what's the vetting process like? How do you decide which Start-Ups are going to be in the Start-Up hub?
00;17;52;19 - 00;18;14;12
Joy Heath Rush
That is a great question. And as you know, Caroline but maybe not all of our listeners do. ILTA has a professional staff, and I head that group, but the beating heart of ILTA was the volunteers and one of the things I ask for from my team, my staff team, is to have a volunteer spirit. And our volunteers are members.
We have lots of business partners that volunteer because they resonate with the mission. So, most of nearly all of the vetting of content and things is actually done by the volunteers, so we had an application process. Some people advised us on what we had a great debate about what defines a Start-Up. How well capitalised are you?
How many years have you been in business? So first of all, you have to kind of decide on those parameters. And then we had, I recall it was 42 I have to go back and check but applications and we're going to end up with, I say about fifteen in the Start-Up Hub. So, it was reasonably competitive, but we're always advised by volunteers on that to say, I'm really interested in this.
I think the other, you know, members and business partners would be interested in in hearing about that and you know.
00;19;08;15 - 00;19;15;13
Caroline Hill
That's really nice and really interesting. So, remind everyone what the pitch thing is that if they're if they're interested in attending.
00;19;15;13 - 00;19;38;06
Joy Heath Rush
Yeah, yeah. We're calling it Innovation Hub and, and basically throughout the day on Thursday we have a room and people can kind of come in and out and each one of our Start-Ups gets 15 minutes to give kind of a Shark Tank type of pitch so people can hear what they're up to, what they're, where they're trying to go.
And it'll be of interest to the press, it'll be of interest to and, you know, people who are investing in legal tech, but it's also going to be of interest to customers because they want to see what's coming down the pike. One of our members, Karen Levy at Debevoise is one, so one of my favourite people. So brilliant one of the things she always says as she relies on ILTACON to, to stumble across new technology and I quote her because I think that's really a great way to express it.
You know, one of the things about the event is we have so such a critical mass of law firm law department, law school, court people, suppliers, press, and you're going to run across things either in the exhibit hall or by talking to someone at lunch and saying, what are you doing about this? And they say, I'm using that product.
And really what I've never heard of that or I'm using this service or I'm trying this approach. And so that idea of stumbling across new things is to me, critical to our mission. And I'm glad to be able to offer it in this very specific way. But I also, you know, you again, you and I both know that ILTACON is a great place for people to announce its established suppliers to announce new initiatives, new products, new services, new alliances, so you can stumble across brand new folks and then new offerings from people you already know and love.
00;21;07;16 - 00;21;22;04
Caroline Hill
It's always completely crazy, Joy, is what it is. Trying to run around and meet people and, you know, go to the sessions, and write about all the announcements. I don't know whether I'm coming or going at ILTACON.
00;21;22;07 - 00;21;24;23
Joy Heath Rush
Something that makes two of us.
00;21;25;18 - 00;21;45;09
Caroline Hill
I just that's so. But anyway. But it's not boring, that's for sure. And I guess on the website, people, because, you know, I really liked on the website and I, I guess people can find the Start-Up because there's, there's I liked the floor plan, you know, when you can actually see because I find I find it all a bit overwhelming.
I've gone for years now, and I still find it all just a bit overwhelming, you know, where everyone is, and you've floor plan on the website and the website is actually really cool. You can sort of just start to familiarize yourself with where, where the different vendors are.
00;21;57;11 - 00;22;19;26
Joy Heath Rush
Right? And you know, we're always trying to think about ways to organise the floor plan better. So, someone had an idea pitched us a couple of years ago about a concept called Neighborhoods in the exhibit hall. So, all the AI vendors are in one place and all the security providers are in one place and that sounds good in theory.
You talk to the suppliers about it and they're like, I don't want to be right next to my competitor. And I want to get there. Is that right there? There is not. So, it's as I'm fond of saying, I have lots of ideas not all of them are good, but we're always looking for ways to make it easier to navigate the exhibit hall because it can be overwhelming.
00;22;42;26 - 00;22;44;05
Caroline Hill
I've, I've heard feedback from people who've been next door to their quite fiercest competitor. It's very funny. It's very funny, but usually not necessarily always the best idea. So, in terms of, oh, so this is one thing I want to ask you. So, I think there's been a new press person. We've had conversations over the years. This is a difficult one for you. It causes controversy each year, obviously, but still, they don't tell me what the position is this year.
Is there a new press policy? I thought I'd see?
00;23;17;13 - 00;23;37;23
Joy Heath Rush
I would say we're evolving. We're always trying to evolve the press policy because I will say when I started in 2018 and I wasn't close to things like press policies, you know, that wasn't something I had to worry about in my prior jobs. And one of the things that was a real struggle that year that I had to learn about.
And you helped you helped educate me about this was about the changing nature of press. So, it used to be traditional print you know, so it was the law technology news reporter, right? It was the American Lawyer reporter or whatever it was, it was the Orange Rag reporter. I've got to stop it. It's always been the Orange Rag I need to say.
00;24;01;18 - 00;24;10;02
Caroline Hill
Sure, you're then there is still is. It still is. And I, I want the newsletter. Is this the Orange Rag. And you're completely fine saying that. No, I.
00;24;10;02 - 00;24;41;12
Joy Heath Rush
Read by the way, I always think of it for so many years, but I had to be educated that bloggers, social media influencers, these are categories of press that didn't exist, you know, ten years ago to any meaningful way. So, it was evolving the press policy to make sure that those people who fit in the modern definition of press are included because they are so actually, Beth Anne and I spent a lot of time working on that in 2019, I think you'll recall there was a pretty big change in our press policy from 2018 into 2019. Then of course, as we did a virtual event that really turned it on its head. So, what is it, what does it mean to have press when the whole thing is virtual? So, I think that where we ended up settling this year was 2025 press credentials.
If people are interested by all means contact Beth Anne, contact me. We can talk to you. We want to have people there that are the right people. And, and what I mean by that is people who really are there to write and contribute. I mean, probably the biggest criterion in our press policy is that people have to be willing to write every day you know, they have to be that has to be their core business.
And people who kind of want to come for the week and then write one article at the end of the week is not so much how we define press for the purpose of our event. So I would say that's probably the biggest kind of water and watershed item and we're always open to feedback from all of you out there who are press people in various is like how do we continue to evolve the press policy so that it is really relevant, current, appropriate to how media cover events and news these days in our industry.
00;26;09;23 - 00;26;15;23
Caroline Hill
So, people who are keen to come, they should just in terms of practically they should just get in touch with you and Beth Anne.
00;26;16;01 - 00;26;23;08
Joy Heath Rush
That's right, yeah. Because we're the ones that can sort it out and well, we'll try to help if we can.
00;26;23;19 - 00;26;46;28
Caroline Hill
Okay. In terms of I say you've been really busy; you've been doing lots of webinars for business partners. I know that this is one of the things, one of the many things you've been doing in your 24-hour.... Yes, webinars. So, what are you talking about? Like what are the business partners and what, what sort of the conversations that you've been having and what do they need to know?
What anyone listening and what's the kind of things that you've been talking about that perhaps might be helpful for people?
00;26;51;03 - 00;27;11;07
Joy Heath Rush
That that's a great question. So, we certainly like to focus on things that are different. That is, we have some of our business partners who are true veterans. I mean we've had 40 something ILTACONS. We probably have a few business partners have been to every one of them. So, some percentage of things change every year.
Some things don't change much at all. So, we try to highlight those things that are changing. Like we have a new lead retrieval system this year that is much better and less costly than the lead retrieval system that's been available in the past. We love to highlight things like that because that's really a business partner benefit. When we made the change last year to serving meals in the exhibit hall, that was a very big change.
But something that had been much requested by the business partners to, so to say, for those of you especially who work there last year, meals are going to be served in the exhibit hall. This is what it means for you. Now, things they need to know about badges and registrations. Obviously, the things about vaccination policy and proof of vaccination, all of that kind of stuff.
But we also try to include tips about how to make the best of your ILTACON experience. Now, I had an exhibitor who's a new exhibitor to us talking to me yesterday saying, well, I hope the demo room should I just keep it open and invite people for open hours? Should I book appointments? Well, I've been there. I've done that.
So, I talked her through the pros and cons of those approaches. And I said, you have to decide from your staffing perspective, but here are the pros and cons. Here are the opportunities that it affords you. You know, here's how a great way to make connections with your potential customers and your existing customers. So, it's trying to be logistics but it's also trying to help people have a great experience.
00;28;55;14 - 00;29;15;15
Caroline Hill
Where it is. Think I like that idea of meals in the exhibit hall because it's so there's so often it's quite detached, isn't it? And you get people that are in there. Do they man the booths or do they? And actually, I quite like the fact that it's the social you could you keep the focus on making a social thing as well as much opportunity to serve drinks and food in there.
Exactly. Great idea. And just so my perspective for business partners, just if I could share one thing, which is if you do if they do have announcements which say they're going to they should share it with journalists ahead of time if they can, that would be if I could feed that thing back you know, immediately they should if possible.
Because what happens is when you get there, everything hits, right? And there's obviously the edge to a great job. You know, you have your media room, but it's like a great big. So, the more notice, I think that they can give people like you.
00;29;48;14 - 00;30;10;26
Joy Heath Rush
This as a former supplier, one year we had a very, very big announcement at ILTACON and we went out to our trusted media partners because we do trust our media partners and said, here's the announcement, we need you to embargo it. And this time and this these are professional media people. They respect embargoes. People understand what that means.
So, give them enough notice to be able to help you make the splash you want to make.
00;30;15;22 - 00;30;38;01
Caroline Hill
And it's great. I mean, I've done a couple of those, obviously, and it works so well being able to get the notification to get the press release and then go meet up and have a chat. Anyway, I wish you the absolute best with the last of the preparation of the last month of the preparation. I think it's been great talking to you as usual, and I cannot wait to see you and everybody else who's attending and no doubt we'll speak again before ILTACON anyway.
00;30;43;13 - 00;31;05;08
Joy Heath Rush
I hope so. And I'm certainly looking forward to seeing you and everybody. I mean that opening reception on Sunday night, people referred to as a family reunion and for me it really is. That's how I feel. And I won't say in addition to some hugs and lots of smiles, there might be a tear or two. I'm just saying that in a good way. In a good way.
00;31;06;14 - 00;31;09;22
Caroline Hill
Thanks Joy, always a pleasure. Thank you so much.
00;31;10;06 - 00;31;11;06
Joy Heath Rush
Thank you, Caroline.
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